Sunday, October 12, 2008

It's Not Just His Past Associations...........What About His Future Ones?

In school, there is always that pack of kids that you would prefer your child not hang out with. In my high school, they were the "outbackers." They were called that because they used to go out back behind the high school and smoke cigarettes and a few other things I am sure. To this day, I hope my children don't hang out with the "outbackers".

I think of that when I look at Barack Obama's associations. My personal beliefs are that Barack Obama is not a Muslim, he is an American, and I am sure he is a great dad to his kids. Yet I have to question a man who has chosen the associations that he has chosen throughout his life. The issue is not William Ayers per se, but you have to ask, would you let your child play at his house?

The issue is not Reverend Wright. To each his own. but would you let your child listen to that hate? The issue is that there is a pattern in Barack Obama's associations. The list is long and the associations span decades of questionable judgement. This is the point that John McCain and Sarah Palin are trying to make.

However, as much as I am concerned by these past associations, it is his future associations that keep me up at night. Who are these associations? Nancy Pelosi, Harry Reid, Howard Dean, Chris Dodd, Barney Frank, and Charles Rangel. This group are the leaders of the Democrat Party. They currently hold key leadership spots in Congress.

What have they accomplished in the last two years? Not much. It's not surprising that they have a 13% approval rating, 9% at it's low. With this group in charge and the possibility of a filibuster-proof majority, there will no longer be checks and balances in our government. There have only been a handful of times in our history where one party has had this much power in government.

There is one big difference between when this occurred in the past and it occurring now.... The Media. Americans were able to depend on the media to hold politicians accountable. They were able to tell the American people when their government had let them down or were about to. We no longer have that watch dog.

For those who wonder why Republicans are scared.....this is a big chunk of the reason. Nancy Pelosi and crew are already counting their chickens and preparing to call Congress back to session after the election. There will be no restraint and the far left agenda will be shoved down our throats.

Just one opinion from Smart Girl.


Anonymous said...

I don't know how the far left policies will taste, but the neo-conservative ones sure didn't taste all that good.

The argument is Bush sucks but we know how bad eight years of his leadership will be, so what's another four.

No thanks. I think we have gone right enough thank you, time for a few lefts.

Though, I am curious, what exactly are the left policies that you are afraid of? That might be too big for a comment or two, perhaps this is really another topic for discussion?

And while we are talking about other posts, what exactly defines a modern day conservative? I mean, what exactly is so gosh darn precious with that ideology?

Please no flames, just give me the facts.

concerned senior said...

I am a long-time Democrat and the thought of a Democratic President, a Democratic House and a Democratic Senate scares me silly. I have seen the Democratic Party leave it’s roots and become something that I do not recognize anymore and can no longer support. If this phenomenon had happened 10 years ago when a level-headed POTUS was on the throne, I might have been euphoric, but with the “save the planet to the exclusion of humans” Pelosi, and crash the economy Frank, Dodd and Shumar, not to mention taking from the workers and giving to the drones is incomprehensible to someone that has worked all their life to enjoy their golden years only to find their investments rapidly dwindling to the point of re-entering the job market at age 72.

We worked hard to accumulate enough for a down payment on our very modest home only to find that if we lived in this generation we could have received a better house with little more than our welfare check and food stamps. Instead of working for our future, we could have just stayed at home and waited for someone to bring our future to us, no strings attached. We wouldn’t have had to support all the people who didn’t want to be tied down to steady employment; we wouldn’t have had to work for our hospitalization, we could have just gone to the emergency room like regular folks and let someone else pick up our tab. Oh, to sleep in in the morning instead of going out in the rain, sleet and snow just to earn a living and pay off the mortgage.

You’re breaking the backs of the working class and lucky for you they haven't realized it yet.

Braden said...

"I don't know how the far left policies will taste, but the neo-conservative ones sure didn't taste all that good.

The argument is Bush sucks but we know how bad eight years of his leadership will be, so what's another four.

No thanks. I think we have gone right enough thank you, time for a few lefts.

Though, I am curious, what exactly are the left policies that you are afraid of? That might be too big for a comment or two, perhaps this is really another topic for discussion?

And while we are talking about other posts, what exactly defines a modern day conservative? I mean, what exactly is so gosh darn precious with that ideology?

Please no flames, just give me the facts."

Gee, Anonymous. I think the Fairness Doctrine is a biggie, don't you?

Or, more importantly, how about this:

I the policies in that video are a pretty good start, don't you?

Mike said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Mike said...

In a serious debate about past associations, McCain and Palin would lose big time.

In terms of future associations, I think Reid and Pelosi should be replaced in the next Congress.

My own choice for the Senate would be Hillary Clinton.

Who would be a good choice for the house?

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
pf said...

I find this site particularly helpful because you cannot get any information from the MSM that does not support obama.

Anonymous said...

American VOTERS are mad as HELL at MSM Obama cronies! Like CNN & MSNBC! causing the outrage against Obama. they are openly in the bag for Obama, MSM, CNN have jeopardized the security of the American people by deliberating hiding serious facts and associations of Obama. HOW DARE YOU jeopardize our great but troubled country? Obama continues to lie and refuses to answer questions that EVERY person running for leader of the free world would have to answer. Obama keeps reaching back to Chicago political past for policy advisers, and pulling one despicable, vile, and even evil “rabbit” after another out of his hat. The list of Obama’s radical associations is long and it keeps getting longer. Some are now well-known, but many are not.



Hatem El-Hady, the head of a Toledo, OH based Islamic Charity that was closed down two years ago by the Federal Government because of its ties to terrorism, has his own page on Barack Obama's Campaign website, in which he discusses his fundraising for Obama.Kindhearts was closed two years ago and its assets seized because of its ties to Hamas. The charity was closed two days before three Toledo men were arrested for their roles in a plot to kill American soldiers overseas. Two of the three have been convicted.

(Bloomberg) -- Nigerian Stock Exchange Chief Exec Ofc Ndi Okereke-Onyiuke being investigated holding a fund-raising event for U.S. presidential candidate Obama, Agence France-Press reported U.S. electoral laws forbid donations from foreigners to electoral campaigns.

(World News)
23 years at TUCC with Jeremiah Wright and James Meeks. Racist sermons on You tube.
He chose the most radical church in the country; Obama chooses to immerse himself and his daughters in hard-core ideological radicalism. Never before has this country considered such a radical leftist for its chief executive.

Michael Pfleger and his hateful and race-hating ramblings, Obama met while carrying out his own radical social activism as community organizer at ACORN, (radical organization) now under Federal investigation for Voter fraud in helping Obama. No one believed he won the caucuses, now we know why. WASHINGTON: RNC filed a complaint with the Federal Election Commission (FEC) against the Obama for an America campaign acceptance of foreign national and excessive contributions. The Obama campaign has failed to comply with federal campaign finance law in its fundraising.

Penny Pritzker, heads Obama National Finance Committee was president of Superior Bank - massively failed, she literally bought her way out of jail paying $460 MILLION fine; was the very epicenter of subprime loan scandal” that has come to eat this nation’s financial system alive.

Fannie Mae CEO Jim Johnson, Obama camp advisor and headed Obamas vice presidential selection committee, discovered he benefited from sweetheart loans from subprime king Countrywide and was fired.

Tony Rezko certainly and his federal indictments and financial dealing with Obamas of course and William Ayers, US terrorist bomber, Obama-co-lecturer, fellow board member, neighbor, and friend.

Terrorist William Ayers
Communist Frank Marshall Davis, obama mentor; Saul Alinsky and Gerald Kellman (Kellman’s Woods Fund is how Obama hooked up and began his long relationship with Ayers.

Chicago lawyer Mazen Asbahi, Obama camp national coord for Muslim affairs also stepped down after news about his stint on the fund’s board - which includes fundamentalist imam - prompting The Wall Street Journal inquiries about relationship with the Muslim Brotherhood and his long personal relationship with Hamas Jamal.

Obama desperately needs voters to forget hes the son of a Muslim father who served an incredibly brutal and corrupt Kenyan government; to forget he attended a madrassa in Indonesia and practiced Islam; forget that he campaigned in Kenya on behalf of Raila Odinga, who relied upon chaos, corruption, and violence in his campaign; numerous associations with radical Muslims; forget the photographs of Obama in traditional Muslim clothes, hanging with Muslim radicals such as Mazen Asbahi and anti-Semite Rashid Khalidi.

Sen. Barack Obama wouldn’t pass a routine government background investigation, not only to become an FBI agent, but a police officer as well. If he were a soldier, his background would preclude him from obtaining a security clearance. He wouldn’t even qualify to be a support person in a federal agency, such as secretary, for that matter. His past cocaine usage disqualifies him from being a DEA agent.

Donna said...

Obama and Odinga

Obama campaigned in Kenya for Kenyan Presidential candidate Odinga in 2006. Odinga is the leader of Kenya's socialist Orange Democratic Movement. In Aug 2007, Odinga signed a "memorandum of understanding" with the Kenyan National Muslim Leaders Forum" agreeing to institute Islamic law in exchange for that groups' support. Muslim Odinga lost the election by over 200,000 votes and then called for protest rallies. Dozens of people were killed.

All of this is documented at ...

Just this week I get an email asking me to sign a pledge at "no more stolen elections".org to join nationwide rallies on Nov 5 to protest voter fraud.

Anonymous said...

Try this site for an eye opener of what our kids are up to these days; I'm sure their parents must be very proud, I know I would(not):

Shelley said...

I grew up being taught to avoid the appearance of evil. Obama embraces it, claiming he didn't know better. That is not very smart for a Presidential candidate.

As for policies, wealth re-distribution scares me. Tax increases to corporations scare me (they will pass those on to the american people). Shrinking our military funding scares me.

BTW, I would consider myself a modern day conservative, and an old-fashioned conservative (you know, the kind that voted for abolishing slavery, women's rights, and civil rights.)
-Political Mommmy

Mike said...

You are kidding yourself if you don't think the reaction from some misguided Obama supporters is not related to the hate mongering from the McCain/Palin campaign.

Sarah Palin brings out the worst in both sides. I keep thinking that John McCain would be way ahead right now had he not pick her, but someone everyone respected. There are plenty of Republicans that would have fit the bill, but he had to be a "maverick".

Their character attacks on Barack Obama fall flat when you look into Sarah Palin and McCain's own past associations. Especially considering that most of those attacks are rather questionable.

Let's start off with the Keating Five. John McCain was lucky to get off with a slap on the wrist, and should have been thrown out of office or maybe even in jail.

He is also close friends with G. Gordon Liddy of Watergate fame. Unlike Ayers, I believe he did serve jail time.

Speaking of Ayers, Obama and he served with several promanent Republicans including friends of Ronald Reagan. Are you claiming that Ronald Reagan associated with terrorists as well?

Back to McCain. He was also part of the US Council for World Freedom. These guys had ties to Nazi collaborators and right-wing death squads, and were involved in the Iran Contra affair.

McCain also received $100,000 from Jack Abramoff's firm. Jack is also in jail right now. I just found this article that McCain may have withheld information to protect some his pals.

John McCain has so many lobbyists working on his campaign that they have their own website. I am sure they will be expecting a lot from John McCain if he wins.

I almost forgot about Enron. Wendy Graham, wife of Phil Graham, was on their Board of Directors. Here is a rant about it.

Now lets move to Sarah Palin. First, there is Troopergate. If she can't handle the power of being the Governor of Alaska or even Mayor without abusing it, how can she and the First Dude be trusted with the power of the Vice Presidency?

Next up is the Alaska Independence Party that Todd Palin belonged to and Sarah supports. These guys were working with Iran to help them secede from the United States. They also affiate with other secessionist groups that want to bring back the Confederacy. They are heavily armed so they can protect themselves when the black helicopers show up to bring in the "New World Order".

Stacy said...

Mike- I would put McCain/Palin associations up against Obama's in a heart beat. The Keating Five...seriously. Are you trying to rewrite history? He was one Republican along with four democrats. The democrat who led hte investigation stated that he did not feel that McCain should have been part of that.

As for the entire report. What would have happened to that trooper if ne had not been related to the Governor, but was just your usual threat against a governor.

I would be happy to defend the other issues, but it appears that would take another blog. Besides you missed the entire point of what I wrote.

ZenBastard said...

Stacy - You're quick to point out that the lead investigator of the Keating 5 did not feel that McCain should have been a part of the proceedings. Funny that you made no mention that the prosecutor who dealt with the Ayers affair has come out & said it's ridiculous to try & tie Obama to Ayers for something that Ayers took part in when Obama was 8 years old.

And of course there's McCain's ties to G. Gordon Liddy which I'm sure you'd like to sweep under the rug. And let's not forget his ties to Abramoff, the multitude of lobbyists his campaign employs, Palin's ties to the AIP.....the list goes on.

Keep on telling yourself that McCain is such an upstanding citizen & that he's such a better man than Obama. You're in the minority there & come Nov. 4th this country will elect the right man for the job, Barack Obama.

Time for a change....

Mike said...


I wasn't responding to you as much as responding in kind and tone to the comments in late morning and early afternoon. I agree that I was a little over the top, but so were those comments.

I would look at Obama's current advisors and supporters to see if you have questions about any of them or for insight on his future associations.

I am still curious if you have any answers for my question from this morning. Who would make a good Speaker of the House assuming a Democratic house?


Stacy said...

You act as though it is JUST the Republicans who have brought up these issues and concerns about Obama. It was not us who brought it to light, but Hillary Clinton. Who said that they would be honored to run with or against John McCain? Oh that's right...your VP candidate. What exactly does that say about JB?

Mike...that was a good question. I would prefer to answer it Nov. 5....ha ha ha. Seriously, I will give it some thought and get back to you.

ZenBastard said...

Stacy - Way to evade the question. But that's usually the way it goes when presented with issues that you don't want to deal with. And when I say "you" I don't mean you personally, I mean right-wingers in general. Transparency is all well and good, until the microscope gets turned your way.

In less than a month the people of this nation will make a decision on who they feel will be the best person to lead this country for the next 4 years. After the way the country has been handled for the last 8 I don't think it's going to be much of a competition.

Shelley said...

In a serious debate, Obama would come out beaten, and most likely thrown out of his Senate seat.

Keating? McCain has lamented about that, and apologized. Who wasn't tied to Abramoff? How about McCain's ties to Clinton, Biden, and Kennedy? If he is so rotten they would be the first to bring it up, oddly they don't.

Frankly, with the way the country is heading, I would like to succeed from the union. (J/K) Palin and her husband attended few meetings, and never truly engaged in party affairs.

Did you know that Khadafi wants Obama to win? The Middle Eastern Muslims all want him to win (they would love a softy) Farrakhan has referred to him as "Chosen". Did you know he campained in Kenya for the politician who killed thousands?

The problem is Obama won't answer these questions. Obama has a hard time answering questions about his policies too. Forget the past, what will he do with our future? Who will he give our future to?

ZenBastard said...

Shelley - In a serious debate? Please, if you think the debates that have taken place aren't serious then you must have been watching something on the Cartoon Network that you mistook for a debate. And don't kid yourself, McCain would fair no better than he has in the past.

McCain may have apologized about his connection to Charles Keating but that hardly makes his actions any less odious. So, by that logic, if Obama were to apologize about knowing William Ayers then I'm sure all would be forgiven, right? Sure it would. And if you believe that then I have a bridge in Alaska I'd like to sell you.

As for Sarah & Todd's connection to the AIP, you need to go do some research & stop trumpeting the party line. Two of the AIP's most influential members were instrumental in getting Sarah Palin's political career off the ground, in exchange for future favors.

I'm not sure who this Khadafi person is you're talking about unless you mean Muammar al-Gaddafi. Either way, it's a moot point. Who political figures in other countries may or may not want to become President makes no difference. But, if you really want to go there then I'll give you a little tit-for-tat. You may or may not remember in 2004, just 4 days before the election Bin Laden released a video condemning George Bush. There were some who tried to spin this as "Osama is endorsing John Kerry". Analysts at the CIA however came to a different conclusion. Based on their research they found that Bin Laden was trying to assist Bush in gaining a second term. Oh, and trying to imply that Obama would be "soft" when it comes to Middle Eastern Muslims is just another sad attempt to portray Obama as a closet Muslim and doesn't deserve any more of a response. Now, who exactly is this Kenyan that Obama supposedly campaigned for? Can you even tell me his name? No, you can't. But even if you could again, the point would be moot. Maybe you should try going to Snopes before you talk about something you have no idea about. In fact, I'll even include the pertinent link for you.

Obama has answered many questions about his policies over the last couple of weeks, much more so than John McCain's off-the-cuff responses of "I know how to fix (fill in the blank)."

At least do some research before you start spouting off on things. In the end you just make yourself look uninformed & foolish.

Stacy said...

Zen-The Washington Times had an article about Obama's cousin Odinga yesterday.

It wasn't the whole story, but it was a good start.

Zen-do you consider me a right-winger?

Shelley said...

Zen, if you want to get into who got who into government, once again we bounce back to Obama. I am past the Ayers thing, sadly, Obama is surrounded by so many other unsettling characters.

I do not think that Obama is a closet Muslim at all. My point is that there are countries who want someone who is soft on foreign policy. Gaddafi (thanks for the correction) hasn't uttered a word the last few years, and now he is spouting off about American politics. That doesn't concern you at all?

Odinga from Kenya (yes,I know his name).

I don't love all of McCain's policies (especially healthcare) but Obama is up in the night if he thinks that his tax policies will help.

The serious debate comment was in response to Mike.

eva said...

Stacy: I would give up sparring with Mike, zenbastard, and some of the anonymous. They are obviously obamabots getting nervous that Obama is not further ahead in the polls at this time. If it was the slam-dunk that the MSM and obamaland claim that it is, Obama will be 15 points ahead and McCain would be all but invisible in Obama’s rear view mirror. Actually, with all the voter fraud by ACORN in the swing states, I am surprised Obama isn’t ahead by at least a 25 point margin. Obama has never won a fair campaign and he is not about to change his strategy now, so how many more surprises is he going to pull out of the woodwork to attack and destroy our election process to suit his needs?

McCain cannot bring up any of Obama’s past or past relationships as he would be called racist. He has to walk a fine line with Obama but Palin should not be harnessed by the same rules. Never has one woman had so much filth thrown at her by the opposing campaign and lived to fight another day. They say she is not qualified should the occasion arise when she would have to take over the Presidency. I say: bull! She has withstood all the degradation the Obama campaign and the Obama supporters have attacked her with and is still standing. If she can handle that, Putin should be a piece of cake.

ZenBastard said...

Stacey – Let me answer your question first. Based upon your article I would have to say that yes, I do believe that you are a right-winger. I’m sure I would be considered a left-winger by many.

Now, to address the Washington Times article you posted the link to.

First off, let’s talk about the author, Mr. Mark Hyman or, more importantly, the Sinclair Broadcast Group for which he is a commentator.

The Sinclair Broadcast Group does not have the best of reputations. Between 1994 & 1997 nine television stations owned by Glencairn Ltd. entered local marketing agreements with Sinclair-owned stations in the same cities. Glencairn was owned by Edwin Edwards, a former Sinclair executive. Carolyn Smith, wife of Sinclair founder Julian Smith and mother of current Sinclair CEO David Smith, supplied Glencairn's initial capital and controlled 70 percent of Glencairn's stock. In December 2001, after complaints from Jesse Jackson and several other media companies, the FCC fined Sinclair $40,000 for illegally controlling Glencairn. Sinclair tried to merge outright with Glencairn in 2001. However, the FCC only allowed four of the stations to come directly under the Sinclair banner. Glencairn kept the other six stations and changed its name to Cunningham Broadcasting. Nearly all of Cunningham's stock (90 percent) is owned by trusts in the name of four members of the Smith family, and all six Cunningham stations have LMAs with Sinclair stations. Based on these arrangements, Glencairn/Cunningham has served merely as a shell corporation with the sole purpose of evading Federal Communications Commission ownership rules. Sinclair owns 56 stations and/or affiliates. Here’s how the numbers break down; NBC – 1, CBS – 2, CW – 8, ABC – 9, MyNetwork TV – 17, and their top network is Fox with 19.

In 2004, Sinclair attracted controversy when it decided that seven of its ABC-affiliated stations would not broadcast an April 30 airing of Nightline, which was a tribute to the soldiers killed in the 2003 invasion and subsequent occupation of Iraq. The group issued a statement that said in part, "The action appears to be motivated by a political agenda designed to undermine the efforts of the United States in Iraq." ABC responded, saying that the program was meant to be "an expression of respect which seeks to honor those who have laid down their lives for this country."

In October 2004, it was reported that Sinclair would order all 62 of its affiliate stations to preempt prime time programming to air Stolen Honor: Wounds That Never Heal, a documentary critical of U.S. presidential candidate John Kerry's anti-Vietnam War activism, just two weeks before the November 2 election. The film was produced by Carlton Sherwood, a former associate of Tom Ridge, and accused John Kerry of prolonging the Vietnam War because of his anti-war activism. The organization Swift Boat Veterans for Truth, an anti-Kerry organization whose name become well known in the 2004 election year, was cross-promoting the film as part of a $1.4 million advertising campaign. Sinclair fired its Washington bureau chief Jon Lieberman, stating he revealed company business when he publicly discussed the documentary in an interview published October 18, 2004, in the Baltimore Sun.

Kinda casts a different light on the whole “MSM is a bunch of liberals” doesn’t it? It also completely undermines the credibility of the author as well as the veracity of the article itself. And before you disagree with that last statement let me ask you this. If this had been an article about John McCain and the Sinclair Broadcast Group was left-leaning would you still view the article in the same light?

Did you go to the Snopes link and read what it says? Considering you posted the Wash Times article I’m guessing that would be a “No”. If you had you’d see that Obama & Odinga aren’t even blood relatives. Obama is however a blood relative of the current POTUS. It also deals with other outrageous claims that Mr. Hyman makes.

ZenBastard said...

Eva - So typical. You spout opinion, innuendo & hyperbole but have no facts to back anything up. Calling me an Obamabot just shows your willingness to tow the party line, Stick your head back in the sand, it's what you seem to do best.

Mike said...

I would not call myself an Obamabot.

I always liked John McCain and didn't come around to Obama until after the conventions much to the dismay of several friends that I would call Obamabots. McCain ran a typically negative Republican campaign when he said he would not, and picked Sarah Palin as a running mate.

People either love Sarah Palin or can't stand her. My wife, who has shown no interest in politcs, volunteered for Obama after seeing her speech at the convention. Her reaction suprised me, but Sarah Palin brings that out in people for better or worse.

How John McCain acted during economic crisis sealed the deal. Neither he nor Obama have come out with any great ideas, but Obama has been cool, deliberate and Presidential.

P.S. It looks like you have competing articles on Obama's involvement in Kenya. The hard part with things like this is finding an unbiased assessment.

I am sure that McCain has "supporters" he would rather not have as well.

Stacy said...

Zen-so basically you're telling me that we shouldn't believe this reporter because he has a bias. Welcome to the world of conservatives. We have a hard time believing much of what anyone on TV or in newspapers writes any more. There are a few that I believe...the others I take with a grain of salt.

This week, several in MSM changed the quotes of McCain supporters to make their comments seem even worse than they were. The women who called Obama an arab and McCain corrected her for example. Several of the media had her calling him an arab terrorist. It was blatantly not true.

Stacy said...

Mike, I finally had a moment to go back and look at the information you linked for me regarding McCain. I will use what I just said to Zen for you as well. Every link took me to the Huffington Post and MSNBC. Do you really believe that these are objective? Really. If you do, then I understand now why you decided to vote for Obama.

Things tend to sound much more snarky in posts than in person. I mean this genuinely.

ZenBastard said...

Stacey - Nobody changed any quotes by McCain supporters. The lady did call Obama a terrorist. If you don't believe me you can go watch the YouTube video for yourself. Here's the link;

Far from being "blatantly untrue", one woman says "he's got the bloodlines" but won't come right out and say it, then she says "Look at the name" trying yet again to make some sorry connection between Obama's middle name & him being some kind of terrorist. But it doesn't stop there. A second woman comes right out & says that she thinks he is a terrorist. So no, nobody in the MSM changed anybody's quote. Watch it for yourself.

Stacy said...

Zen-that is not to which I was referring. It was an old lady at a McCain townhall that was taken out of contect. I saw the video you referred me to...I don't agree with what is said on there.

There are uneducated people on both sides. did you hear the Obama supporters on the Howard Stern show...we can point those fingers both ways. I am not disputing that.

ZenBastard said...

Stacey - Yes, I realized after I posted & re-read what you had said that we were probably talking about two different people. But that is the woman that the MSM are referring to when they talk about someone calling Obama a terrorist.

I totally agree that there are uneducated people on both sides. Unfortunately it's pretty much avoidable. And if you specifically go looking for those kind of people, well, you're bound to find some.

Did you go to the Snopes site & read what it had to say about the Obama-Odinga connection, or rather the lack-thereof?

Anonymous said...

If I am white and voting for McCain, then I am a racist.

However, if I am black and voting for Obama then I am an informed citizen voting on the issues.

If that is indeed fact, I found this video a bit confusing:

eva said...

Why is it when Obama supporters don’t like what others have to say, it’s always “you are uninformed and put your head back in the sand”, etc. If I towed the Party line, I would be voting for Obama and not McCain (I’ll bet you didn’t see that one coming zenbastard).

Although I have always considered myself objective, I find my tolerance for stupidity is overriding my ability to be objective with some of the postings that I have been privy to over the past few months.

Saying that the pick of Gov. Palin for V.P. made you decide to vote for Obama is just about the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard and makes me feel sympathy for my country as you are not alone in your prejudice. Gov. Palin has just as many, if not more, qualifications as Gov. Clinton and Gov. Bush did and we voted them into office; only it wasn’t just as second in command, it was as POTUS. Most other countries have had women as leaders, and good ones at that - - - is America so far back in the ice age that the thought of a leader other than a male is foreign to us? I guess if you’re looking for an excuse not to vote for someone, you can always bring out that tired old: “I was for him until he ran a negative ad”. Or how bout this one: I was for it until I was against it. If you decided against voting for a candidate that is running a negative campaign, then I guess you will not be voting for either McCain or Obama, will you?

At least be honest, you just don’t want a woman in power, any woman. My one great fear is that when you finally decide to take the plunge you’ll put Nancy Pelosi in that position and then God help us all.

The thought of an Obama Presidency with the support of Pelosi, Reid, Frank, Shuman, Dodd, etc., are enough to really make me consider putting my head in the sand because the fallout from that administration is going to be the start of another American revolution. While we are fighting to get our liberties back, we will be overrun by the new world power on the horizon. And we will have no weapons with which to defend ourselves as I distinctly heard Obama say he is going to stop the funding for any further weapon development and dismantle all nuclear capabilities. In case you haven’t noticed, the only reason America is safe is that we have superior defense. Do you honestly believe the rest of the world are going to stop their research and developement and lay down their arms in peaceful harmony?

First we will have socialized medicine under the umbrella of National Health; then we will have socialized “redistribution” of wealth under the guise of helping the poor (not to mention those with a very real anaphylaxis to work); after that the domino affect with regard to Amendment #1 to quiet dissention and then Amendment #2 to eliminate any further “distraction” from the real goal: communism. Congratulations, mission accomplished; let’s hope they appreciate your voting support and they let you be one of their soldiers “of CHANGE” instead of being one of the rest of us, the HOPEless.

ZenBastard said...

Anonymous - As Stacey & I were just discussing, if you talk to people that are not informed on the issues then you're going to get people who sound like complete idiots. That goes for both sides.

I personally don't agree with the whole "if you're white and voting for McCain, then you're a racist and if you're black and voting for Obama then you're an informed citizen voting on the issues" angle. That line of thinking is just another attempt to divide people.

ZenBastard said...

Eva - Show me where I said anything about not wanting a woman in power. Or show me where I said that I was voting for Obama because McCain chose Palin. Personally I have no problem with having a woman as VP or even POTUS, provided she is qualified. If Hillary had gotten the nod instead of Obama I would be voting for her instead of McCain, because I think she's qualified.

Gov. Palin has just as many, if not more, qualifications as Gov. Clinton and Gov. Bush did when we voted them into office? Please tell me you don't honestly believe that. She doesn't have anywhere near the qualifications that either one of them did.

My comment about you being uninformed and/or sticking your head back in the sand stems from you not providing any kind of links to back up what you're saying. You just start spewing opinion as if it were fact & expect everyone to believe you.

Z said...

This is exactly what has a lot of Americans so concerned.

Do any of you on here agree with these people? Do you think Obama is a terrorist?

eva said...

zenbastard: there you go with that "spewing" again. How bout replacing it with: “ejecting” or “discharging” for a start, just to get a little variety into the posts of the opposition. “Injecting something” sounds a lot less repulsive than “spewing something”, don’t you think?

And, if you were reading the rest of the posts, you would have concluded that "Mike" was the perpetrator of the "after the election he came around to Obama due to the negativity of the McCain campaign”; and then there was "the picking of Palin was the clincher for me” type comments.

And to clarify my “opinions”, the country is already divided, no surprise there unless you are of a delusional nature. Stacy has provided you with numerous substantiated facts and you reject most of them so why would I bother to present more when you are already rooted in your convictions. If you think that trying to undermine Stacy’s blogs will net you more votes for Obama, I think you are under a misapprehension as to the strength of Stacy’s convictions or the legitimate concern of the visitors to her site.

My other favorite site is a Democratic one that shares my opinions and supports most of Stacy's; we are not alone, check it out and see how receptive they are to your opinions:

ZenBastard said...

Eva - "And, if you were reading the rest of the posts,....etc" I've read everyone of the posts. The problem is that you don't address your posts to anyone. As far as I could tell you were talking to Mike, me & whomever else disagrees with you.

What substantiated facts?!?! She posted a link to one article of dubious nature. If you have actual facts & evidence to back them up then by all means I want to see them. And I'm not trying to undermine anybody's anything in order to net more votes for Obama.

NoQuarterUSA is Democratic?!? Larry Johnson is a registered Republican who supported Bush in 2000. That hardly makes his website a Democratic one.

So I guess we're left with agreeing to disagree.

And I'm still waiting for comments about this YouTube video;

Has anybody even bothered to watch it? If so, do you agree with the sentiment?

Stacy said...

Zen-I don't ignore the links, but most of the time I have two seconds to respond and I don't always have the time to look at all of them. I have three small children that require the majority of my time. As I said this is a hobby.

I did watch the video. It was a waste of my time. We already agreed that there are uneducated on both sides. The video proves nothing more. Rachel Maddow and Olbermann are two I would rather not waste time listening too, but thanks.

ZenBastard said...

Stacy - Unfortunately what's being said by the some of the people on that video is more serious than just being uneducated. There's a big difference between talking to someone who has no idea that Palin is actually McCain's running mate & not Obama's and having people talk of someone being a terrorist & talking of killing him.

How would you feel if the roles were reversed & people were calling McCain a terrorist or making "kill him" statements about him at Obama rallies? You know good & well that right-leaning people nationwide would go ballistic and there'd be hell to pay.

Stacy said...

Really the only difference is that the things said by McCain supporters is blastered across MSM. These items in Michelle's article are some of the tame ones. can be offensive so read at your own risk. We could go back and forth on this all day. It will get us know where.

eva said...

Well, zenbastard, since Stacy was busy I decided to take a look at your video. Did you really expect me to take that seriously? There were comments by Hardball (MSNBC) and CNN. If it wasn’t for Lou Dobbs, I will never tune into CNN. Hardball and every one of the biased commentators on MSNBC are notoriously prejudicial for Obama and you rarely get anything from them that is not “spewing” hatred for anyone not agreeing with them. It is also owned by GE; you remember them, the ones that are dealing with Iran? I have not bought a GE product nor listened to an NBC station since learning of their traitorous dealings with Iran and have no intention of doing so until their CEO is fired (without a golden parachute).

Where is the outrage when Obama supporters are throwing Molotov cocktails at McCain supporters doing little more than hosting a McCain/Palin sign on their front lawn? Where is the outrage when seeing T-shirts with the words denigrating Gov. Palin with “puckf---ker“ on them or other similar filth? Perhaps that filth is ok with you, but those words aren’t even in my dictionary let alone my vocabulary. It is not only disrespectful to Gov. Palin, it is disrespectful to me as a member of the female persuasion.

Where is your outrage when Madonna incites her crowd to yell obscenities to and about Gov. Palin? Where is your outrage when journalists write pornographic scenarios about Gov. Palin? In fact, just where are your morals if you have no problem with what the Obama supporters and their immoral Hollywood celebrities are saying about a woman that has done nothing more than run for a position in government?

If you’re ok with all that disgusting behavior, why should you be upset when the shoe is on the other foot? Voters are getting fed up with the slander and disgusting filth perpetrated against an American mother and her family and I’m with them every step of the way. If they can call Palin a slut and a C—t, and they can accuse her 15 yr. old daughter of producing a Down-syndrome child, etc., then I can call Obama a friend of a terrorist (which is more truthful than any of the filth about Palin).

Some of our citizens are mad as hell and aren’t going to take it anymore. There is more at stake than electing a new president; Joe and Jane six-pack are tired of picking up the tab. We are in this economic crisis because Obama and his friends, i.e., Pelosi, Reid, Frank, Dodd, Shumar, Rains, et al, have given homes to people with little more than a welfare check and food stamps as collateral for a loan. ACORN stormed the banks and intimidated them into extreme sub-prime lending at the expense of the middle-class. Obama wants to “redistribute” the wealth. I will never deny help to a person who is trying to help themselves but I believe in workfare and not welfare. I will not spend 30 yrs. paying for my mortgage and watch someone else get a better home for free.

Obama may yell: J-O-B-S into his crowd at his rallies, but the rest of us didn’t hear the J, we just heard O(bama) B.S. He says he is only going to tax companies $250,000 and up? Just where do the think the trickle-down effect is going to end up? If you said middle-class then I believe you are getting the drift of this piece.

I don’t have to cite facts and figures for you - - - all you have to do is take the blinders from your eyes and the earplugs out of your ears. Try a news channel that is not in the tank for Obama; don’t believe that brainwashing hype that Fox News is in the tank for McCain, they are just not bowing down to Obama, but they are not giving him or McCain a pass either.

Sorry Stacy, but their are none so blind that cannot see or so deaf that cannot hear. I guess I just had to scream and get in someone’s face or explode.

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