Thursday, November 13, 2008

"I Don't Think We Have The Votes!"...... Thank Goodness!

There may be a small chunk of goods news in the midst of all the bad bailout news.  It appears less likely that the Big 3 auto dealers will be seeing any chunk of change now or in the future.

Sen. Chris Dodd to ABC News:  "I want to help them if we can, but I'm not going to give anyone a blank check, so we're going to try and do something if we can next week.  I don't think the votes are there.  Candidly, I don't think we have the votes to get that done.  With no big change between now and next Wednesday, I'm skeptical."

The Democrats will need help from Republicans to "get it done" even in January. Republicans are less likely to agree to the deal after the last $700 billion bailout.  Could they actually have learned their lesson?  Republicans have stated that if they bailout the auto industry it will just be a matter of time before the next industry lines up.

It is even more crucial that at least one of the three Senate seats currently up for grabs remains in the hands of the Republican party.  Americans were angered by the last bailout and continue to watch their tax payer dollars being thrown at problems that aren't getting fixed.

We can hope that those so-called "blue-dog" Democrats can still hear their constituents screaming in their ears or we are going to have bigger problems in the near future than those we have today.

38 comments:

rt. said...

Not to be too pessimistic, but I am not going to hold my breath on this. Then there is the 111th congress coming up...
I have done some bail-out blogging here

An American Liberal said...

Let's be fair here, the Democrats asked for 25-30 billion of the 700 billion that the Republicans have been handing out to their friends. While I don't agree with it, let's at least try to be fair.

Um, as an example, Citibank paid our general dividends after getting tax payer money. That's right, Big Business used your tax money to spread the wealth to their own. And don't even get me started on AIG....

Are these people just stupid or crooked?

An American Liberal

Clay Bowler said...

One thing that the Republicans need to remember, are the states that the UAW holds a large presence in tended to go blue. It doesn't seem like they are going to be hurt by standing their ground on this. Michigan is a mess, and look who runs the state.

Stacy said...

To be fair...I think all of the bailouts stink. I don't think we should be bailing out private industry period. Market problems need market solutions and the gov't to keep it's nose out of it.

curious said...

clay bowler: Are you suggesting that a woman is governor of Michigan and therefore the mess?

Retired Spook said...

I was watching one of my favorite financial pundits, Neil Cavuto, on Fox a few minutes ago. As the Market opened down nearly 150 right out of the gate, Neil was asked by the reporter if these wild roller-coaster days (an 800 point swing yesterday afternoon from down over 200 to up nearly 600 at the close) were going to become the norm. His comment: that the investing class simply has no confidence in the political class to fix this, to which I looked at my wife and said, "duh". It's the political class, as Rev. Wright would say, "riding dirty" on the investing class that caused most of the financial strife we're witnessing.

Paul Farrell had an interesting article at MarketWatch earlier this week that didn't pull any punches about what's going on.

http://tinyurl.com/5wroyq

An American Liberal said...

Thank you for that article Spook.

These people need to be put in handcuffs and carted away. This stuff makes me absolutely ill to my stomach.

Retired Spook said...

American Lib,

I don't think the average American has the slightest clue how bad we're screwed. And if Obama does half what he's promised, it's not only going to get worse, but MUCH worse. What's really sad is that what most people would like to see under the new administration is a justice department that goes after the crooks and charlatans responsible for this mess, regardless of political party. Instead, from everything I've read, it appears that Obama and the Dems are going to engage in a vendetta against Bush administration officials for all sorts of irrelevant, perceived evils.

Just as the last couple years has been largely about preserving capital, the next couple years is going to be about survival. But I keep telling myself -- if we survived Jimmy Carter, we can survive anything.

Anonymous said...

If the Republicans want to oppose Detroit's bailout they are going to have to articulate why it's OK to bailout the financial sector but not manufacturing. So far I have heard anyone doing that.

sanityinjection said...

"What's really sad is that what most people would like to see under the new administration is a justice department that goes after the crooks and charlatans responsible for this mess, regardless of political party."

Oh, good, where should we start? With the people who signed mortgages they knew they couldn't afford to pay? The liberals who forced the government to ignore basic economics and grant those loans? The CEOs who exploited them to make obscene personal profits? The Bush Administration who did nothing to stop any of it? How about the ordinary American workers who greedily invested their money in hedge funds promising high rates of return, empowering those fund managers to engage in rampant speculation that put P/E rations on steroids?

There's plenty of blame to go around for the fact that the US economy is in a recession, which is not actually all that apocalyptic an event. Car companies pleading poverty is not new either. Which is a better use of everyone's time, pointing fingers of blame at the past or figuring out the best way to proceed for the future?

Sure, the American people want "the bad guys to get punished". But comic-book didactics are not an appropriate basis for a system of government, along with strange women lying in ponds.

An American Liberal said...

Anonymous,
And there in lies the rub. It seems that the government is more apt to help Wall Street than to assist manufacturing jobs that directly impact Main Street. Or at least that is how the pundits portray this.
There are a large number of businesses hurting, and if the government wants to give out money then look to see a line of people with their hands out. If you needed a reason to hate the bailout, that comment should make the downside crystal clear.

SanityInjection,
Thank you for your post, it was very interesting.
However, I have never been a big fan of blaming victims for the deceit and criminal actions of some. When a company uses a "crisis" to enrich themselves in a dishonest manner, then those responsible should be imprisoned.
We have seen this with Haliburton (after how many infractions we are still only passing out fines only?!), and now we have Citibank giving out general dividends with our tax money. At some point, people need to be held accountable for their misdeeds, and sending a few to jail would certainly help curtail the looting of our coffers.

On that point, where is the oversight for this bailout? Last time I looked both Congress, and the Administration were supposed to have nominated people to oversee this madness (checks and balances)? Where is the detailed report that was supposed to be sent to Congress on the actions of the Treasury?

These "conditions" were written into the bill that authorized this bailout, and if they are not meeting the agreed to principles, then turn off the spigot of money. Bring these people back to the table for another chat. While we are there, perhaps they could reflect on the efforts of other ailout plans(the Brits as an example have a FAR better plan than ours), and incorporate those elements that make sense for our particular economy?

Unfortunately, that is really the crux, there is nothing to cause these people to pause, and there is no one in the current government that holds anyone accountable for their actions. We already know that there is no personal accountability amongst this crew, and in the absence of that, people like me would like to have a STRONG justice department doll out some consequences.

I do not think that is too much to ask.

An American Liberal

PS Just to show my liberal colors, I think personal responsibility should apply to the Bush Administration. Giving immunity as part of a bill is a legal trick to avoid prosecution, and it sickens me. Rumsfield at the very least needs to be marched in front of the World Court for crimes against humanity imho.

Grace Explosion said...

The graphics look easier to read with the white background. I'm concerned that the Democrats could "stonewall"... wait for Obama to get in office... and go so crazy with that bailout money. The people said, "No bailout!!" and they did it anyway. Who is going to pay for all this??

OK, check out my blog and tell me what you think of Ray McBerry?? He's running for GA Governor, possibly, in 2010 in the Republican primary.

http://draftraymcberrygeorgiagovernor2010.blogspot.com/

Eva said...

As long as we're dishing out "personal responsibility" to the Bush administration (which I heartily agree), what about the Liberal Gestapo who assisted, i.e., Pelosi, Reid, Frank, Schumer (just to name a few).

Whatever happened to term limitations? I vote out all incumbents and have encouraged others to do the same; unfortunately, no one wants to vote out their Congressman/Senator who is bringing home the bacon but agree that I should definitely vote out mine. The longer they are allowed to maintain their seat, the greedier and more corrupt they become. We can’t get rid of them because they make up the laws to serve themselves. We tell them by mail, email or phone calls what we want but they are not interested in what we have to say. If we initiate criminal charges against them, we have to pay for their attorneys. No wonder they don’t listen to us - - - they have all the power, we complain but do nothing; let the other guy do it!

An American Liberal said...

Eva,
I absolutely agree with everything that you have said. But before we indict all of congress, we have to first realize that stupidity/incompetence is not illegal.

Purposely bypassing both national and international laws should incur jail time imho. Frontline's "Bush's War" is one of my references for this comment.

Just to reiterate your comments on term limits --- yeppers I vote them out too. This is a priviledge, not a career imho.

Oh, and I vote out rubber stamp congressional members as well.

Peace!
An American Liberal

Retired Spook said...

Eva and Amer. Lib,

My wife and I have also adopted the anti-incumbent mentality, particularly with judges who have to be re-affirmed every two or four years. Unfortunately, we live in a pretty red area of a pretty read state -- Indiana. The rest of the state went for Obama this time, but the Fort Wayne Metro area (Allen County) just to our east was the only populist county in the state that went for McCain. Just an interesting side note -- Obama lost 77 out of 92 counties but won the state.

Quite often in Indiana we see candidates running unopposed -- especially Republicans, and especially at the local level, but sometimes even at the national level. That was the case two years ago when Senator Richard Lugar ran unopposed. I simply left his square blank, as did a lot of other people judging from the post-election statistics. Still, any message was lost on him. He's been in the Senate so long he's got barnacles, and it's clear from responses I gotten to letters and emails written to him that senility has set in. This year I even voted against our incumbent Congressman in the primary. He still won, and then won the general by a healthy margin.

Eva is correct. It doesn't take long in the corrosive atmosphere of DC before most of them forget that they work for us and not the other way around. Oh well.....I wonder what ever happened to tarring & feathering and running the bums out of town on a rail.

Eva said...

Knock, knock - - - is anyone out there?

1. We have to restore balance in 2010; leaving one Party in power longer than that can have catastrophic consequences for our country and our economy.

2. We need to have an oversight committee to oversee the oversight committee and a committee to oversee them, etc. If we keep them busy investigating each other, perhaps they will not have time to integrate and collaborate into their greedy predecessors.

3. Unless Obama develops his own backbone, he owes a lot of money-people a lot of payback. We can only hope that his biggest lie was not to the American voters but to his financial and political backers - - wouldn’t that be poetic justice; the puppet is now the puppeteer.

4. Nancy Pelosi can single-handedly destroy this country if given free reign from Obama and the Congress. Nancy has said she would never let us drill and will save the planet whether we like it or not. To wit the gas prices will again rise as OPEC is reassured that they are still in control. If we could harness the wind power coming out of Nancy Pelosi’s mouth, we wouldn’t need to drill for anything as she really could solve the energy problem sing-handedly. We will never be independent of foreign energy and foreign influence if the Democratic Congress has their way.

5. The bailout was a humongous mistake and not one the American people wanted; but again, no one was listening to us. There is no transparency and if any one person knows where all our money is going, he is not about to share it with the public.

CEO’s are inducted onto the Board of Directors of each others’ corporations and therefore write their own exorbitant salaries and outrageous conditions of employment. If we are to bail them out, it should be on our terms and not theirs; but again, we are just an insignificant source of capital.

6. If Congress has their way and unions get control with card check, we will see even more industry leaving the U.S.

7. Obama wants to renegotiate NAFTA out of existence so Canada is looking overseas to friendlier climes. Canada is our closest ally physically, politically and philosophically and we need to maintain that relationship and not isolate ourselves from our friends.

8. Our exorbitant capital gains taxes are killing our industries and greedy stockholders are forcing companies to seek friendlier climates. We have to become more competitive and bring industry back to America or suffer the consequences.

9. I’ve heard and read that we need to bail out Detroit in the eventuality we could be faced with an additional war; might need them to build tanks, etc. If the boycott was turned on us how would we make those tanks since most of our steel industries, et al, have been deported; where would we get the steel, rivets, bolts and the like to build these vehicles? Without foreign countries, we would have to send our troops to war naked and without shoes, guns and bullets? Doesn’t anyone realize that at the current rate, we will be all but defenseless by the next generation; dependent on other countries for everything but our food? We don’t make anything but malls in this country: Americans build them, maintain them, manage and work in them - - - everything else is made in China, Mexico, Indonesia, India, and wherever.

10. We need to stop illegal immigration, but Nancy Pelosi wants to stop their deportation and give them rights and benefits so they can continue flooding our country and legally rape the system.

My suggestion to stop illegal immigration is as follows:

(a). Make pre-addressed, pre-paid postage applications available to everyone south of the border to apply for citizenship to the U.S. so they do not have to actually inconvenience themselves to make the trip. By return mail we can issue their social security and medical info.

(b). Rather than overrunning our hospitals in the upper 48, we can build hospitals next to the border to meet their needs.

(c). On the reverse side of the form can be an application for driver’s license, voter registration, welfare and/or disability benefits to expedite the process and minimize expenses. And, naturally, at the bottom will be that famous “honor system” box to be checked just to keep everything honest.

And if that works out well, we can start the same program overseas and around the world. The possibilities are endless.

Knock, knock - - - is anyone out there?

An American Liberal said...

EVA,

Thank you for competing with me for the longest comments on this blog! :-)

And Pelosi is not that bad, and let me assure you, she represents her constituency lock, stock and barrel.
BTW, it should be remembered that the Bush Administration did little to stop the rolling blackouts that wiped out many small businesses in California, even when it was discovered that market manipulation was to blame. I think California was the seventh largest economy in the world at the time, and Bush let it go.
Keep that in the back of your mind when you hear Pelosi. It explains some of her positions quite nicely.

Retired Spook,
I live in the middle of a blue neighborhood in a blue state (Washington), so I TOTALLY understand where you are coming from. The lack of competition is so poor here that I have found myself voting straight ticket or darn near close (which is embarassing and irritates me to no end).

I don't want to embarass the man (or add to his embarassment)so let me keep his name anonymous but the Republican nominee for one of our national congressional seats was an airline pilot. His "slogan" was something about "I want to keep you safe, like I keep my passengers safe".
No participation in the community outside his job, and his education wasn't even close to passing muster. And while I have the utmost respect for airline pilots, I do not understand how that job prepares you for a national seat in congress....

Not to sound selfish, but I want state, county, and municipality to be purple. Is that too much to wish for?!

An American Liberal

Eva said...

American Liberal: You're welcome - - - and you're right, Nancy Pelosi isn't that bad, she's worse. When she speaks, we exercise our right to depress the mute button.

Nancy Pelosi's constituency is California and if you haven't noticed, that excludes 49 other states whose wishes do not necessarily coincide with the liberal Liberals in that state.

Global warming isn't in my vocabulary and it certainly is not man made. The Democrats are constantly pushing pro-choice and global warming and I am heartily sick of both issues. Just another scare tactic to garner votes from voters too lazy to think and research facts for themselves. Al Gore, the tree-hugging hypocrite, doesn't conserve any energy and wastes enough for an entire community of 800 homes. I'm not sure about the Pelosi residence but I would imagine her plane trips back and forth add to the ozone layer more than my jaunt to the grocery store.

Retired Spook said...

Not to sound selfish, but I want state, county, and municipality to be purple. Is that too much to wish for?!

That's not selfish -- that's just stupid. Besides, where would be the fun in everybody thinking alike. Can you imagine how dull things would be if EVERYONE was a "moderate". One of my favorite quotes is from S.C. Justice Antonin Scalia:

“What is a moderate interpretation of the Constitution – half way between what it says and what you want it to say?”

Eva,

There are only two things scarier than an Obama presidency: (1) having Obama die and Biden become President; and (2) having Biden die and Pelosi become President. As much as I disagree with all that Obama has promised to do to this country; we better hope he stays healthy.

Retired Spook said...

Back to the topic of this thread; this AP article from yesterday spells out pretty much where we're at as far as an auto industry bail out:

http://tinyurl.com/6z49u8

Doesn't appear to be much consensus.

Eva said...

Retired Spook: Amen to point (2). Here's to Obama's continued good health.

However, it is evident that Pelosi is and has been running the government with or without Obama or Bush. She proclaims and it is done; men quake at the mere mention of her name. Right now she appears to have more power than any president and hasn't had to shoulder any of the blame. Hillary never had a chance because Nancy did not want any woman to have greater power than herself; and the fact that she suceeded gives me nightmares. I don't think she wants to be President, she wants to be the ultimate power behind the throne facade.

An American Liberal said...

Retired Spook.

My purple comment was meant to indicate my desire to see a good mixture of blue and red politicians. In my efforts to be clever I used a "color" already used to identify moderates. :-)

I want a mixture of voices, sorry that came out different than my intent.

As for Pelosi, what exactly has she done to warrant such hate. She is definitely a hardcore liberal, but what exactly about her makes you have such vile contempt for the woman?

An American Liberal

Retired Spook said...

I want a mixture of voices, sorry that came out different than my intent

I'm OK with that, and you're right, it didn't come out that way.

As for Pelosi, what exactly has she done to warrant such hate. She is definitely a hardcore liberal

Asked and answered - heh. No, seriously, only speaking for myself, I don't hate her -- I just disagree with her on pretty much every issue. Is it not more than a little frightening that she's 2 heartbeats away from the Presidency?

Stacy said...

Wow everyone. I am impressed. Thank you for such a thoughtful, respectful debate on the actual subject in which I wrote. That really doesn't happen much. I have read through it, but didn't have a chance to respond. thanks Stacy

An American Liberal said...

So the person two heartbeats away from the presidency causes you some fear?

That's okay, because the current president and vice-president have scared me to death for eight long years. George still has a month to really cement his infamous role in our history.

I can't believe conservatives supported and still support this admistration? Bush isn't a conservative on any level....

Back to this topic, based on an article in WSJ I believe, if these three go into bankruptcy it is unlikely that they will emerge. Meaning bankruptcy for these car companies means that they are done. As odious as it is for me to say this, we can not allow this to happen.

If the financial data being presented is correct, the impact of letting these businesses fail would be extraordinarily hard on main street. We have given up too much of our manufacturing to other countries, it would be nice to try to keep a little of it....

Warmest Regards.
An American Liberal

Wm said...

Why bail them out? Why not put them on the auction block and let someone buy them that is serious about making a profit. If it takes a foreign company, so what; without feeling the least bit guilty or responsible, Americans buy more foreign cars than American-made cars and those companies are not asking us to bail them out so they must be doing something right.

We have no guarantee that this bailout will fix the problem and most likely will only be a reprieve and not a permanent solution and will only be a continuation of business as usual. It will not fix the problem and will be nothing more than corporate welfare checks; why not eliminate the middle man and just give the workers the checks.

Perhaps Detroit will no longer be the car capitol of the world and we have to make peace with that and move on to getting training and help for displaced workers.

Retired Spook said...

Am. Lib and Wm,

Here's a WSJ article from a couple years ago that points out just one of the many reasons why a bail out is like flushing money down the toilet.

http://tinyurl.com/5wxb9q

Am. Lib, your comments about President Bush remind me of the old saying (I'm paraphrasing): Liberals think Conservatives are evil; Conservatives think Liberals are just wrong. Just like every President in my lifetime except Carter (I'm 63), Bush has done some things right and some things wrong. Since his approval rating is somewhere around 30% or less, and more than 30% of Americans identify themselves as Conservatives, then clearly all Conservatives don't approve of the job he's done. But I've never understood the visceral hatred of Bush by so many on the Left. If you just compare the number of staff members, cabinet members and close associates who were indicted/convicted during Clinton, compared to Bush, then W was a breath of fresh air.

Now, all that said, I won't shed any tears as Bush and Cheney ride off into the sunset in 60 days. My only hope is that Obama breaks most of his campaign promises.

An American Liberal said...

WM,
The problem with your view is that it deals with absolutes. From CNN:

"The Center for Automotive Research, a think tank in Ann Arbor, Michigan, that is pushing for a bailout, estimates about 2.5 million job cuts if just half of the Big Three's manufacturing capacity shuts down.

About 240,000 of those job losses would be at the automakers; 800,000 would be at various suppliers and dealerships; and another 1.4 million job losses would come from businesses that rely on automaker spending, the think tank estimates."

From the same article:

"President Bush and GOP leaders in Congress say they'd be willing to lift some restrictions on an already-approved program to dole out $25 billion in loans meant to help U.S. automakers design more fuel-efficient vehicles.

The funds are now tied up in Energy Department red tape, but the GOP says it would be willing to approve legislation to force their prompt distribution."

From Money:

"They say millions of jobs could be lost and more than $100 billion in wages sliced out of an already-fragile U.S. economy."


Okay, just so that everyone understands this, the money that they are seeking was already approved by President Bush back in September of this year. Unfortunately, they have not been able to get access to it due to "red tape". Now they are asking that the same amount of money be lended to them as part of the $700B package made available to Wall Street.
The loan was made to them under the premise that it would go toward the manufacturing of more fuel efficient vehicles (volt). The Big 3 have been shouldering this cost waiting for the funds to be released to them. With the downturn in the economy, the money that they had been investing in these new cars needs to be reallocated to keep them in business.

CitiGroup by comparison was given billions of dollars and then turned around paid out general dividend and today announced that they are slashing jobs.

Investing 25B to preserve 100B in jobs seems a better course than the current strategy of bailing out banks who continue to fatten themselves at the expense of their employees, our tax money, and ultimately, our economy.

Your thoughts?
An American Liberal

An American Liberal said...

Retired Spook.
This is way off topic, but you did ask. Why would I have such disgust for Bush and his administration?

I don't know, President Clinton's lie resulted in one stained dress, and an impeachment attempt.

Bush's lies resulting in thousands dead, and Obama bin Laden still at large.
His incompetence led directly to bigger government and bigger deficits.
His Administration outed a CIA spy as political payback for an unkind editorial. Last time I read the law on that kind of action, that was considered treason.
His direct manipulation of Global Warming science led to the loss of business opportunties in a new worldwide market.
His abuse of our military, and the resultant veterans.
His belief that "torture" needs to be "redefined" at a base outside the jurisdiction of U.S. courts.
His approval of the illegal imprisoning of thousands of Arabs post 9/11 without cause or charges being filed. We will be paying reparations for that (just like for the Japanese Americans during world war 2).
His incompetence during Katrina.
His inability to understand basic economic trends. Our economy has been tanking for a while, but Bush cronies pushed for a more favorable views in leiu of proactive efforts. Sending rebate checks to people was truly indicative of his incompetence. Now we have a $700B bailout and looks to be a worldwide deep recession.

His inability to own up to any of his mistakes and take responsibility for his utter incompetence ("Mission Accomplished", "I have looked into his eyes...", etc.).

As for the Administration members not being sent to jail, it reminds me of the stock mob character on a police show.
"16 charges, zero convictions!"
Just because they haven't been convicted, does not mean that they haven't been commiting criminal actions. Point in case, passing a law to allow amnesty for those who conducted and approved the use of torture.
Zero bid contracts worth billions of dollars to obviously connected and corrupt companies.

My question has always been, why aren't more people infuriated with his actions? Perhaps you could explain.

Peace.
An American Liberal

Retired Spook said...

Perhaps you could explain.

Sorry, Am. Lib, to attempt to explain to someone as thoroughly brainwashed as you appear to be would be an exercise in futility. Some of the points you make are valid, but most are simply not based in fact. I do admire your ability to consolidate 37 pages of Daily Kos talking points into a few brief and concise paragraphs, though. Well done.

I'm perfectly willing to cut President Elect Obama some slack until he does something that negatively impacts me personally, rather than just attack him unmercifully starting on January 21, 2009, but I know an awful lot of Conservatives who are not as forgiving and easy-going as I am. I truly hope I and the 55+ million Americans who did not vote for Barack Obama are proved wrong about him, and that he governs in a way that is completely at odds with everything he's done in public life up to this point.

Andi said...

American Lib.: Was that a freudian slip or did you mean to write "Obama bin Laden"? Check into that, you may be a closet Conservative.

P.S. In case you missed the indications, whether they are a Democrat or a Republican, they all stick together and cover each other's butt. If they finally investigate and find wrong-doing by some of the Senator's taking VIP mortgages and hush money or campaign funds from Fanny, Freddie, Gold.Sach, et al, it will be covered up, explained away, or pardoned. They protect their own; unfortunately, it's a closed club and doesn't include the border guards rotting in jail - - I fault Bush for letting those men and their families suffer and will hate him with my last breath for that very reason.

An American Liberal said...

Retired Spook.
I do not read the Daily Kos or watch MSNBC.

Love to watch Fox (hate Hannity, and Red Eye though), CNN, and CNBC a great deal. Also love to read a few blogs like this every now and again (a lot lately obviously).

I also enjoy good documentaries from Frontline and others who's partisan efforts aren't so readily apparent (just say no to Stone and Moore).

Nope, sorry came up with that list all on my own.

As for Obama, agreed, time to set aside partisanship and hope to heck that he lives up to his promise (vs his promises).

Seems like I should put something like "also likes long walks on the beach" here.... LOL!


Andi,

That was an embarassing typo, ugh.
As for the border patrol thing, I am sorry, but what are you talking about?
Obviously, I'm not a big fan of Bush and one more thing might push me over the edge and make me do something crazy like vote for a Democrat for President!!! Oh wait....

:-)

An American Liberal

andi said...

A.L.: Where have you been that you are not aware of two of our border guards (Ramos & Compean) rotting in jail for wounding an illegal alien carrying drugs across the border. They are in jail and the illegal testified against him and was given immunity. Naturally they let him go and he was additionally caught once again bringing drugs over the border. They tried and convicted the guards and should have been pardoned long ago by Bush; actually, they should never have been tried or convicted but the "liberal" judge wouldn't allow testimony that would have helped the guards case. One of the guards has been brutalized while in jail and they have had to put him in protective custody.

Thanks Bush, I hope what goes around comes around for you.

An American Liberal said...

Andi,
Thank you for the response and yeppers, I remembered this. For some reason I thought both of these guys had been released?

My attempts at pretending to be a gentleman prevent me from ranting about this nonsense. Maybe Bush will pardon these two as he leaves office?


All,

Back to this topic, it looks like I was in error, the request from the automakers is $25B above the $25B already promised to them.

Sorry, in that case the cash spigot needs to be turned off.

Good by GM, so much for my dreams of owning a Volt.

An American Liberal

An American Liberal said...

Couple of op-ed pieces from the NY Times.

Don't be afraid to read from this bastion of liberal media. You will find the articles interesting, I promise.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/19/opinion/19romney.html

and

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/15/opinion/15sat1.html?ref=opinion

Warmest regards,
An American Liberal

An American Liberal said...

I have corrected the links from above post:

here

and

here

Andi said...

Don't try to peddle the NYT on this site; journalism died this year and NYT was the front runner. They do not report the news, they invent it.

Thanks for the heads-up; if the NYT is your source of reference, I won't have to waste my time reading your blogs.

I researched the NYT's articles this year and found them to be inaccurate, biased and bull. You’d do much better with the National Enquirer if you’re looking for fiction and fairy tales.

No wonder you didn’t know about Ramos or Compean, the NYT was too busy promoting Obama to be bothered with insignificant matters.

An American Liberal said...

Andi,
Sigh, one of the op-ed pieces was by Mitt Romney. You know, that ultra conservative from Utah? His father was the president of one of the big 3 for time, and sorry, I thought it was insightful.

As to the other one it was brought to my attention this morning on Fox and Friends (the on air wife mentioned it was a good article). While looking it up, I found Gov. Romney's piece.

Warmest Regards.
An American Liberal

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