Sunday, December 7, 2008

Do you travel to the dark side and if so why?

Do people subconsciously befriend people who share their same beliefs without knowing before hand? Do we tend to gravitate to live in areas for the same reason? For example, I live in a blue state, but I happened to move to one of the reddest counties in the state. Was it intentional? Of course not, we moved to the county and to the neighborhood based on a completely different set of criteria.

I am obviously conservative. I started a conservative women's movement, SGP, so I hope I am conservative. I tend to read conservative websites, news sites, and blogs. That is not to say that I don't read information regarding the other side of the aisle. To read about the Democrats, I don't have to go any further than the New York Times, NBC, CNN and on occasion MSNBC for laughs. When I am really ambitious, I will read the Dailykos.

I do not, however, go to individual left leaning or liberal websites. What's the point? It's not about their beliefs, it's about mine. I definitely do not go there and try to debate them on their vision of the world. Do you go to the dark side? If you are conservative, do you go to liberal websites and leave comments berating their point of view? Do you go there and call them names, tell them how stupid they are, and they should go back where they came from?

What possesses someone to argue in that manner with someone they do not know? I don't think liberals are evil. I don't think they are bad people. They have a different view of the world and a different way in which to change the world. I do not agree with what they stand for, but I don't attack the person.

I chose not to go to the dark side. I am interested, however, in how many of you do? Do you make the journey to the dark side of the aisle and if so why?


Disclaimer: No, American Liberal, this is not about you. You are still more than welcome to debate your points of view.

17 comments:

Grace Explosion said...

I guess the first thing I would ask is, do you believe there is such a thing as "evil"?? What would it take for a person to be evil??

I think murder is evil. I think people who murder people are evil. I think people who support the murder of people are evil.

I think liberals are evil.

They may be ignorant of evil and therefore not believe they are evil, but abortion is evil... they are for it...and it makes them evil.

Why do we compromise the basic definitions of what is good and evil so that then we can be declared evil for being good??

There is no compromise to me.

Abortion is murder and it is evil.

Those who practice it and those who promote it and ESPECIALLY those massmurderers who perform it... are EVIL.

Why can't we admit that we are sinners and that murder is evil and many of the other policies of the liberal left are evil??

I don't really go to the liberal sites. But they show up at conservative sites or sometimes comment on articles I read.

Unless we don't believe in God, we must believe in evil. When we stop believing that there is evil - when we stop believing that people are evil... the lights have gone dim... and we can no longer see that God is perfectly holy.

I see that God is holy.

I believe people are evil... and God's grace is their only hope. :)

Grace.

Boat holiday yorkshire said...

Very interesting post.I enjoyed well while reading.Thanks!

Clay said...

I moved to Chicago 14 years ago. I found dating and making friends hard due to the rampant liberalism that's eaten a great city. I even had a girlfriend tell me that we didn't think enough a like and that she was afraid it would affect her job in social work (after I helped her through college of course).

Retired Spook said...

Starting before the 2004 election, I used to read over a dozen blogs and news sites and comment on half of them up until a couple years ago. I found very early on that debating a Liberal is like mud-wrestling a pig. The pig enjoys it; you get dirty, and soon no one can tell you apart. Most Conservative -- Liberal debates I've participated in have devolved into name calling or, if they stay civil, simply ended with each side agreeing to disagree. I consider myself pretty open-minded, but I have yet to have a discussion with a Liberal who changed my mind on any of my core principles, and I'm sure the reverse is also true. The two mindsets are, for the most part, irreconcilable, whether it's moral issues or government's role in our lives.

Visiting Leftist news and blog sites is depressing, plain and simple, and, on the few occasions where I've ventured to the dark side, I've come away with the reaffirmation that most Liberals are extremely negative, nasty and unhappy individuals. I still read and comment on a couple conservative blogs, but most discussions are via email with other Conservatives I've met on-line.

An American Liberal said...

I think there is a misunderstanding amongst the general populace as to what constitutes "Liberal" and "Conservative". IMHO we are constantly served up the most extreme examples of both, and in all honesty find ourselves disgusted by both.With that in mind let me give some generalities about both to help clarify why I am here at least.

Conservatives are generally: hard working; family and religious oriented; believe in personal accountability; not afraid to succeed; strong supporters of military might; and generally tend to be older. Those are all GREAT things in my book, but (and there is a but) they also tend to be: resistive to change; tend to be myopic (can't see the forest through the trees); content themselves to the present (not too much future thinking with this crowd lest to complain about degrading morality); and very, very inclusive (they become politely uncomfortable with the "Liberal in the room").

Liberals are generally hard working people who care about the world and it's people. They still believe in their hearts that we -as a people- can do far better than we are;. strongly believe in a government that is run by the people for the people; believe that we are part of mankind more so than any particular country; believe that we should be better stewards of our environment; believe that peace if given a chance can prevail; strong advocates for education; believe in technology; very accepting; and generally are very open to change.
Those are all good things, but they tend to allow their optimism to out pace reality (can't see the trees while admiring the forest); distrust almost everyone; ashamed of individual success; and do not comprehend the impact their ideas have on others.

Both have their pluses and their minuses, but both have value. To listen to only one view is tantamount to only hearing part of the orchestra. So I'm here to try and understand why many elements of the liberal agenda are so vehemently opposed. I'm here to try and understand, and occasionally learn.

Warmest Regards.
An American Liberal

Mel said...

While I read massive amounts of news from many places, I do not go to liberal blogs because like you I see no purpose in it. While there are left leaning folks I do respect they are ones I know in real life and we occasionally talk about politics but never get ugly or nasty with one another.
Excellent topic!!!

Eva said...

American Liberal and Retired Spook are two sides of the same coin and one of the many reasons why I decided to become an Independent (a moderate - - flexible and tolerant of other people and other ideas and ideals that will make our country and our world a better place for future generations). I believe in compromise, researching the facts and not creating or buying into fiction, and working for the good of all mankind. I do not believe liberals or conservatives are evil; I think real evil lies within individuals regardless of political affiliation, race or religion. I don't think you are evil if you are an atheist, Jew, Muslim, Hindu, et al, or just do not believe in Jesus Christ as your savior. Goodness lies in the hearts of people who strive to do the right thing to the best of their ability every single day and do no harm to others. I believe in the rights of others to choose abortion as I believe you are the keeper of your own conscience and responsible for the consequences of your actions. I acknowledge the Ten Commandments as the Golden Rules to live by based on common sense and not on any particular religion. In the end, you will have to answer for your choices, right or wrong, whether to your God or to karma. I do not believe in Hell but in personal retribution by your harshest critic - - yourself.

You cannot departmentalize or pigeonhole people into a conservative or liberal grouping. Each of us makes our choices based on our life experiences and environment and is subject to change as our lives continue to expand and change. We are not one thing or the other, but an accumulation of circumstances that shape the person we are and the decisions we make at any given moment - - neither conservative or liberal but somewhere in-between.

Kat said...

Wonderful Topic. I used to. I used to spend a lot of time reading liberal blogs... specifically the self defined liberal Political Mommy Bloggers. I felt some strange compulsion to understand how they could believe as they do, how they seemed to live in such a different country than I do. I rarely commented as confrontation is not my thing, but I read them a lot. Finally I stopped because I was so disheartened by what I was reading. I agree with Retired Spook. I no longer travel to the Dark Side. Instead I try to inspire and encourage those in the right.

An American Liberal said...

Good morning all!
Well, I found another completely off topic tidbit to share.

Hope it makes you smile!

The Doghouse

Warmest Regards.
An American Liberal

Terence Smelser said...

Do I travel "to" the dark side? No. It very possible that I have always been a "darksider".

I grew up in a conservative home, in a conservative town, in what is for the most part, a conservative state.

I am "knee jerk" uncompromisingly conservative. The common, polite term is "Right Wing NutJob". I'm quite comfortable with that.

I have a few liberal friends, I think some put up with me, just to see what I do or say next. I have said (written) a few things on my personal blog that has deeply offended their sense of self... or is it Fair play?

Such delicate creatures...

Oh, I don't have a lot against the common liberal, I think they are silly and to unrealistic to really have a voice, so I don't listen.

The idea that "I" should be willing to work harder, to help provide for those that are "down trodden" is just to much to say with a strait face. THIS is America, there are no "Down Trodden" here, there is a bunch of useless, lazy, stupid, 3rd and 4th generation leaches that seem to think they are.

I have the perfect solution, I would pass this into law if i could. Work, or eat from a dumpster.

However, there is a new brand of liberal in America today, the Liberal Socialist. These people are dangerous. The constitution means NOTHING to them as it stands in the way of POWER, theirs.

These creatures are to be, abraded, looked down upon, thwarted, denounced, irritated, angered, publicly embarrassed, treated as sub human, ... (get it?)

There stands the enemy, all we can do, may not be enough, if we do not ALL do it.

In some instances I don't travel "to" the Dark Side, I'm a tour guide.

An American Liberal said...

Welcome to the blog Terence Smelser!

Warmest Regards,
An American Liberal

texasholly said...

I will admit to being very glad the election is over. I read a lot of blogs and for the most part I don't agree with any of them. After awhile I just was skipping my regular reading.

I think there is more weight in the way people LIVE vs. what they say. Most people I know LIVE conservatively. Many of them don't vote that way.

I have no idea why there is such a disconnect. Many of them are stuck on one or two big issues that rarely relate to their daily lives.

Makes me crazy.

Just found your site through twitter where I followed you. Love it!

An American Liberal said...

I think there is more weight in the way people LIVE vs. what they say. Most people I know LIVE conservatively. Many of them don't vote that way.

I have no idea why there is such a disconnect. Many of them are stuck on one or two big issues that rarely relate to their daily lives.


First of all, let me welcome you to the site!

As to your comment above - that is a very astute observation. I certainly live a very conservative life, but agree with much of the liberal agenda.

You asked why, and I have an answer for you:

I have children.

I have an earnest belief that despite our successes, we as a people can do far better on a large number of issues. It is my belief that we should leave a future that is brighter, and more full of hope than what we inherited. We can not do that by clinging to past beliefs, and simply not acknowledging problems around us.

Passing through the living room the other day, I heard that the modern environmental movement got its start when the Cleveland river (I believe that is what he said, though I have never heard of such a river - bleh, if I got it wrong, please forgive me, but the name really isn't germane) burst into fire for the fifth time or so. It would seem that all waste from the industrial sector was dumped unfilterd into the river and had burst into flames again.... Some one thought, this isn't right, and thus began the Environmental Revolution.

The Liberal ideals are not bad, evil or even that toxic to Conservative ideas. The process of implementing these ideas however can be odious at times. Far Left leaning Liberals, want desperately to get to their version of Utopia and don't really care how many people they trample on to get there.

But I disagree with Conservatives who are content with their lives and have no desire to stretch their lives or opinions more.

Proposition 8 (California) is a perfect example of this. The Bible is about Love and Acceptance, but yet it is and has been used sooooo many times to maintain the second class status of people. Women, people of color and now homosexuals have all be the focus of the Bible based hatred (anyone see the irony here) disguised as something benign to undermine the rights of human beings.
Does anyone else remember the massive Protestant marches from early in the 20th century? They were all in KKK garb?! Protecting the virtue of our (white) women was the mantra of the day?!

Sorry for the rant, but I just do not understand the repeat of history.

Anyhow, I hope that explains things a bit.

An American Liberal

Retired Spook said...

As to your comment above - that is a very astute observation. I certainly live a very conservative life, but agree with much of the liberal agenda.

No offense, Am. Lib., but I think that is a hypocritical load of horse hockey.

IIRC, it was the Cuyahoga River near Cleveland that burst into flames. You may know some, but I don't know a single person who thinks it's cool for a river to burst into flames. I've voted in every general election and all but one primary since 1966, and I don't recall a single politician, of either party and any level who ran on a platform of making the air and water dirtier. This notion that Liberals are for saving the planet and Conservatives are for trashing it is one of, if not the biggest lie of the last century, a lie that is perpetuated daily by the Left.

As far as your analysis of Prop 8, it's the classic use of moral relativism that is so unique to the Left.

But I disagree with Conservatives who are content with their lives and have no desire to stretch their lives or opinions more.

Huh?

An American Liberal said...

RS stated: "I've voted in every general election and all but one primary since 1966, and I don't recall a single politician, of either party and any level who ran on a platform of making the air and water dirtier. This notion that Liberals are for saving the planet and Conservatives are for trashing it is one of, if not the biggest lie of the last century, a lie that is perpetuated daily by the Left."

That is a bunch of hogwash RS, and I am not going to debate you on this issue. Surely, that Nobel Prize must look good over Bush's mantle? Oh wait, the Left wing nut job candidate won that award (oops, my bad)....


RS shared: "As far as your analysis of Prop 8, it's the classic use of moral relativism that is so unique to the Left."

Or, we have it right, and at some point in the near future, just like every other time in history that this has come up, the opinion of the right will be villified as narrow, hateful, and wrong.


AL said: "But I disagree with Conservatives who are content with their lives and have no desire to stretch their lives or opinions more."

RS responded: "Huh?"

Thank you for making my point.

Warmest Regards.
An American Liberal

Retired Spook said...

That is a bunch of hogwash RS, and I am not going to debate you on this issue.

LOL!! I would have expected no less. I consider myself a conservationist, but radical environmentalism really is difficult to defend. I don't blame you for not trying.

Oh wait, the Left wing nut job candidate won that award (oops, my bad)....

A Freudian slip and and admission that the Nobel Peace Prize isn't worth a bucket of warm piss all in one sentence -- well done.

Thank you for making my point.

And your point was that you disagree with people who are content with their lives. I know that Liberals thrive on shared misery, but........... I'm sorry but that is just tooooo funny, in a sad, pathetic sort of way.

And, as far as gay marriage is concerned, at least in my case, hate has nothing to do with it. I have a niece who is gay, and her sexual persuasion is of absolutely no concern to me. I just think that redefining something as basic as marriage will open a can of worms that we really don't want to open. I have no problem with civil unions as a legal form of partnership between couples of either the same or even of the opposite sex. You and I are just going to have to agree to disagree on this one.

An American Liberal said...

A Freudian slip and and admission that the Nobel Peace Prize isn't worth a bucket of warm piss all in one sentence -- well done.

Sarcasm was the tone I was striving to convey. Alas, you (and others like you) see a bucket of warm piss, the rest of the world sees a Nobel Peace Prize winner.

But I do not blame you too much, the Right have a convincing argument to support their views. I say views because it keeps changing every time they get caught manipulating the science.

Please do not think that I am preaching that we should all live like Grizzly Adams in some sort of Hippy commune. We have some significant environmental issues that need to be addressed and it causes me grief to see political appointees manipulate raw science out of sheer greed. It distresses me further to see EPA standards diminished and important regulatory agencies such as the EPA and even the Department of the Interior reduced to something akin to a joke. And yes, the much vaunted Republicans have done this and more, but I am sure you are well aware of this. If not, please let me know, I have some GREAT books, a few links and a documentary or a dozen on these subjects to share.


And your point was that you disagree with people who are content with their lives. I know that Liberals thrive on shared misery, but........... I'm sorry but that is just tooooo funny, in a sad, pathetic sort of way.

Now see, I think the same thing about people who just give up on life. To you, we are unhappy unless we are chasing wind mills. To us, looking around at the positive changes that we have helped come to fruition is exhilirating. It is analagous to explaining the joys of growing a vegetable garden to someone who is simply content to push their cart through the aisles. Irregardless of what you may think, there is great joy and happiness in the struggle to create something better.


And, as far as gay marriage is concerned, at least in my case, hate has nothing to do with it. I have a niece who is gay, and her sexual persuasion is of absolutely no concern to me. I just think that redefining something as basic as marriage will open a can of worms that we really don't want to open. I have no problem with civil unions as a legal form of partnership between couples of either the same or even of the opposite sex. You and I are just going to have to agree to disagree on this one.

You already know that homosexuals should be given the same rights as everyone else, and that my friend is the whole damn point. Good for you, there is still hope of making you a liberal yet! :-)

Warmest Regards.
An American Liberal

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